One of the perks of working on Arkham Unhinged was being able to tell stories with the versions of the characters that I was a fan of. They had to merge with how they were portrayed in the Arkham City game of course. But DC and Rocksteady still allowed a lot of leeway in the stories I was able to tell and the versions of the characters I wanted to write. The most perfect example being Talia Al Ghul.
In the New52, and more specifically in Grant Morrison's Batman Incorporated, Talia is portrayed as extremely vile to the point of insanity. Someone willing to threaten Batman with choosing to either save Gotham or save their son, and putting a price out on Damian's head that ultimately leads to his death. For better or for worse, that's one of many interpretations of the character over the course of her creation. Just not the one I cared for.
In the New52, and more specifically in Grant Morrison's Batman Incorporated, Talia is portrayed as extremely vile to the point of insanity. Someone willing to threaten Batman with choosing to either save Gotham or save their son, and putting a price out on Damian's head that ultimately leads to his death. For better or for worse, that's one of many interpretations of the character over the course of her creation. Just not the one I cared for.
The version I always liked was how she was presented in the animated series, and closer associated with her comic origin. A woman stuck in the middle between two men in her life; the loyalty she shares with her father and her romantic feelings towards her "beloved" Batman. I like that grey area for the character. Not outright evil, but with each confrontation between the two men in her life, the choice of which side to take always hangs in the balance for her. The type of stories good soap operas (or comics) can take full advantage of.
When Talia first appears in the game, it's to help save Batman's life. And during their conversation, she mentions the night they spent together in Metropolis. Immediately it was like a bell going off in my head…there's a story there to tell. It also allowed me to flashback to earlier in their history together. To tell their first meeting in the Arkhamverse timeline. And a nice excuse to revert back to the way her hair was in the animated series…longer, darker, and hanging over one eye. Femme fatale!
Getting a chance to also tell a story outside of Arkham City and outside of Gotham, would be another interesting venture. Since the game mentioned Metropolis, that brings to mind some very familiar characters from that city. Yet aside from showing the Daily Planet building and S.T.A.R. Labs, I couldn't show or mention any of those familiar people. Such is the way these video games can be set up. You don't always have the particulars of the decisions behind this, but have to work around what you're allowed to do. Or to put it another way: It's a bird, it's a plane…and that's all it was.
The story I ended up writing followed some familiar beats to their relationship. They meet, they're saved, Batman is brought back to the family to meet her father, Ra's wants Bruce to join his family, but once the darker threat is revealed about who Ra's is, then Batman will forever oppose him. And while Talia has feelings towards Bruce, she'll never be able to convince him to join or kill her father. So her loyalty will stay with her own family, for now.
Getting a chance to also tell a story outside of Arkham City and outside of Gotham, would be another interesting venture. Since the game mentioned Metropolis, that brings to mind some very familiar characters from that city. Yet aside from showing the Daily Planet building and S.T.A.R. Labs, I couldn't show or mention any of those familiar people. Such is the way these video games can be set up. You don't always have the particulars of the decisions behind this, but have to work around what you're allowed to do. Or to put it another way: It's a bird, it's a plane…and that's all it was.
The story I ended up writing followed some familiar beats to their relationship. They meet, they're saved, Batman is brought back to the family to meet her father, Ra's wants Bruce to join his family, but once the darker threat is revealed about who Ra's is, then Batman will forever oppose him. And while Talia has feelings towards Bruce, she'll never be able to convince him to join or kill her father. So her loyalty will stay with her own family, for now.
I always found the idea of Ra's being in Gotham during the time of Wonder City to be a missed opportunity. A chance to portray an earlier Gotham and a younger Ra's. And I believe even when writing the game, that Paul Dini had some ideas in mind for wanting to write more about that time period even outside the game. But it wasn't meant to be, for either of us.
Also I had a slightly different ending to this story in mind when I turned in my first draft. I thought it would be a cool nod at the end of the story, after Talia fails and returns to her father, if Ra's would mention that Talia's son is waiting to see her. He could've said Damian or left the child nameless. But the implication would be that Talia got pregnant during Bruce's stay at Ra's home all those years ago, and secretly had the child without Bruce knowing. But understandably I think it left too many questions or concerns, that they didn't want to broach. Fan-service denied! Yet... if you look at the very last panel, I sort of came up with the alternative. Talia is touching her belly (slightly covered up with the caption box in print, but more visible here). A possible hint that she got pregnant during their meeting in Metropolis. At least…that's what I wrote in the script and choose to believe.
Also I had a slightly different ending to this story in mind when I turned in my first draft. I thought it would be a cool nod at the end of the story, after Talia fails and returns to her father, if Ra's would mention that Talia's son is waiting to see her. He could've said Damian or left the child nameless. But the implication would be that Talia got pregnant during Bruce's stay at Ra's home all those years ago, and secretly had the child without Bruce knowing. But understandably I think it left too many questions or concerns, that they didn't want to broach. Fan-service denied! Yet... if you look at the very last panel, I sort of came up with the alternative. Talia is touching her belly (slightly covered up with the caption box in print, but more visible here). A possible hint that she got pregnant during their meeting in Metropolis. At least…that's what I wrote in the script and choose to believe.
Someone's expecting... |
Federico Dallocchio turned in a great performance drawing this story, as well as Alejandro Sanchez on a subdued coloring palette. They'd have to juggle the action scenes along with the quieter, tender moments between these characters. Federico drew a wickedly staged delusion that Bruce is in as he's fading in and out of a poison induced fever dream. There was this gory scene of crows picking away at Batman's eyes, and tearing an eyeball from its socket. It was more graphically presented in the original art, but was edited down for digital. And then reverted back to the original version again for print.
When tasked with drawing Metropolis, Federico I believe referred to a map design of how the city looked off an old roleplaying game supplement that he had or found online. Only after he drew it, was it decided that Metropolis shouldn't look like that older version on the edge of a cliff and waterfall. So he changed it to reflect the more natural New York style look to the city. You can see the earlier version below to compare the two.
Metropolis: Before & After |
I was really happy with how this issue turned out. I'm a sucker for a good tragic character or failed romance, and it was nice to visit these characters in happier times as well as sad ones. It remains one of my top favorites of my entire run.
Bless you for writing Talia as she's meant to be. I really, really hate what Grant Morrison did to her. I much prefer the conflicted woman who was torn between love and loyalties. This is was a bright spot for Talia fans who've had to endure a lot in the past few years.
ReplyDeleteOops, hit the wrong reply button.
DeleteYeah Talia ha been portrayed a number of ways in the past. But I always prefer this version myself and glad there are those that do as well.
(Hi I'm the Anonymous above.) It's really, really appreciated. Not only this but your work on Li'l Gotham with Dustin (Talia in the Mother's Day issue made me incredibly, incredibly happy - and so did the Father's Day issue!) has been really beautiful for Talia fans (and well, every DC fan!) So thank you again. Always looking forward to more!
DeleteTalia is due for a return appearance in Li'l Gotham sometime down the line. With Damian around, she's sure to show up.
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ReplyDeleteYour Talia is spot-on. I really appreciate your characterization of her. Honestly, I can't stand Grant Morrison's Talia. Batman Inc just upsets me. I can't read it. But Li'l Gotham on the other hand is so sweet beautiful. Thank you for giving us Talia fans something to love!
ReplyDeleteThanks for enjoying it!
Deletesweet *and* beautiful whoops
ReplyDeleteYou write Talia so beautifully. A lot of what I see concerning her in the comics lately has been ... not to my taste, but your work on Li'l Gotham and Arkham Unhinged is a sweet relief. You obviously understand the character and enjoy writing her. Thank you so much for giving us Talia fans something to enjoy!
ReplyDeleteTo me she's always been more than just a villain, so that portrayal never sits well with me. The conflict of being in the middle between two people she cares about (three, if you include her son), always makes for a more interesting character.
DeleteThanks for giving us your take on Talia, both in the comics themselves and in this blog. You write her brilliantly. Your version of her hearkens back to her classic appearances, in which she occupied a space between the "good" and "evil" binaries. She's a passionate and COMpassionate person, with a complex sense of morality and duty. As I've said on my Talia fanblog, I would fully support you writing her in the new comics canon, too.
ReplyDeleteCan't wait to see her again in Li'l Gotham!
Not sure what is going to happen with Talia after Batman Inc wraps. I imagine eventually she might shift back to a different version than the current one. Different writers, different tastes. But she will show up again in Li'l Gotham.
DeleteThanks for reading!
I'm glad you're going to keep her up in Li'l Gotham - and I hope you or someone who loves her gets to write her again. The Batman Inc finale has left a sour, sour taste in this particular Talia fan's mouth. Again, thank you for the work that you do. Always a pleasure.
DeleteI haven't read any of Batman Inc, but it seems to have divided a lot of people.
DeleteBut at least there will be more Al Ghul related fun in Li'l Gotham.
I would love if dc did an al ghul family book with Ras, Talia and Damian. This family along with Batman offers stories full of conflicts and divided loyalties, angst and what it means to be a family, etc. You would be my pick to write that since you get Talia a lot.
ReplyDeleteI love your work and thanks for keeping Talia humanity and complex as a character.
At one time, this being about a couple years ago after the New52 launched, I was interested in pitching DC for a Robin title. There were plenty of Batman titles and Batman & Robin, but no Robin solo book which seemed odd. Dustin and I pitched it as a book that would see Damian take on cases that meant something to him. He had already shown feelings towards other kids his age or younger (tracing back to Streets Of Gotham and Colin). It might take him outside of Gotham even, if the story warranted it.
DeleteThe main backdrop to the title would involve the Al Ghuls. Damian might come across cases where Ra's was criminally invested in them. But also, Talia would show up from time to time to check in on how Bruce was raising Damian. She might even approach Damian to come back to the Al Ghul side of the family. That his time away had served its purpose (getting to know his father) and return to offer him a role to rejoin her side of the family. And of course, that would put Damian in a position very familiar to Talia…right in the middle between two sides.
I'm not sure if the pitch ever got read or was considered. DC was right inside the first year of their relaunch and I'm guessing had a lot of things planned with the books they had. I even heard at that time, they were already working on Andy Kubert's Damian mini-series (which only recently got announced).
But that's how it goes. You learn to understand there's always a lot of things in motion, many out of your control, and getting a pitch seen and green lit is a lengthy procedure. It took us many years to even get Li'l Gotham finalized, and after that process, it made me realize how long these things take (if at all).